Eps 254: Real Talk with a 15 Year Old

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Casey O'Roarty 0:04
Casey, hello, hello, hello. Welcome to the joyful courage podcast, a place for inspiration and information on the parenting and humaning journey. I'm your host, Casey. I am a positive discipline trainer, parent coach and personal growth junkie, also wife and Mama to two incredible teenagers that teach me every day what it means to find grace and humility joyful courage is the integration of positive and conscious parenting tools with the willingness to choose in to personal development and discovery practices. I'm so happy that you're here. If you're looking for more community and conversation, please consider joining one of my Facebook groups. Live and love with joyful courage, or joyful courage for parents of teens, both are a soft landing for support and celebration.

Hello, listeners. I am so excited to introduce my guest today, Ian o rurdy. Ian is my youngest child. He turned 15 on October 30, and is a freshman in high school. He is the baby in the household, and taller than all of us. He is passionate about basketball, loves his friends, and has melted my mama heart since day one. I say that Ian is my positive discipline kid because he was the one who was and has always been game to create a routine or role play a situation. He was always willing to go along with my parenting, and I would also say that Ian and I are really close. I'll let him share his experience during the interview, but we have a really tight relationship. He's always been really open with me, and it doesn't seem like there is really anything that we haven't talked about or can't talk about. He loves his family time when we're all together, and is super stoked to have his driver's permit. I am honored that he is willing to come share candidly with all of you on the podcast. Hi. Ian, welcome. How does it feel to hear me introduce you?

Ian O’Roarty 2:30
It's pretty accurate. All the description gave is kind of a weird thing on the podcast, but you know, it's cool. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 2:42
yay. Well, my community got a really excited when I said that you were coming on to talk to me. There are a lot of parents who follow my work that are raising teens, who are raising sons, who have kids that are like 14, 1516, they have a lot of questions that they shared with me, and just like I did during my show with Rowan, I want to speak to the audience and remind you all that Ian is a regular 15 year old guy. He can speak from his own perspective, but I want to remind you that your teen is having their own unique experience. So in this conversation with Ian, I just invite all the listeners to pay attention to what lands for them. So Ian, how are you doing with covid, your dad's cancer, there's been a lot to navigate. How are you I'm

Ian O’Roarty 3:39
good. I this, like, at the beginning with this covid, it was definitely easier to just start with this covid without, like, that's cancer and school, really. But then it got into dyes cancer and then altered it once covid Cancer school. So I'm just keeping it day by day, doing one thing at a time. You know, I'm not getting ahead of myself.

Casey O'Roarty 4:03
Something that I really appreciate you. About you, Ian, is that you are really easygoing, like you seem to roll with stuff pretty well. Would you say is that the experience that you're having like in your head? Are you rolling with it? Are you stressed out and spun out in your head? Or do you feel like, even in your head, you're pretty easygoing role with that kind of guy?

Ian O’Roarty 4:26
I I just feel like I'm able to roll with things, you know, because I just try to think about, like, not everything at once, you know, just thinking about, like, one thing at a time covid is like, what I need to do for school. Just it's a lot easier to manage when you're not trying to tackle everything at

Casey O'Roarty 4:44
once. Yeah, what would you say has been the biggest challenge this last year? What part of all of those crazy things that our family has been gifted, what part of that has been the hardest for you?

Ian O’Roarty 4:59
I. Probably either, like when you guys left, and me being home with their own alone, or I just not being able to see friends and hang out with anyone.

Casey O'Roarty 5:13
Yeah. So I just want to let everyone who's listening know part of my husband's cancer treatment was required he and I to be in Seattle, which is about an hour and a half from where we live in Bellingham, for about two months. And so Ben and I lived in Seattle, and the kids, Ian and his sister were up here, and after a lot of conversation, we decided that they could be here alone, and I would come home, I came home most weekends, and Grandma came up one time. What was hard about that? Would you say being up here and on your own with Rowan,

Ian O’Roarty 5:50
probably just all the responsibility now, having to go to the grocery store, manage making a meal, doing my school, getting homework done, and just like all the things that we had thick. Of

Casey O'Roarty 6:03
all the things, was it kind of cool to get to dip your toe into what it will feel like in the future when you're on your own? Or was it just hard and annoying?

Ian O’Roarty 6:15
Yeah. I mean, with the responsibility came freedom, like, you know, yes, right here to tell me like to get on my back if I was doing something like you didn't want me to do, like, maybe I was turning on the TV a little earlier than you guys would have liked. But overall, I think it was just it was cool for a little while. Then it just became like, okay, When are they coming back? Like,

Casey O'Roarty 6:38
come on. Yeah, you're ready. That was a hard time for us to being apart from you guys, and I just want to shout it out to you and to Rowan I and I think I've said it on shows before, just so proud of the two of you and who you are, and so grateful for the skills that you do have. I mean, you guys managed you fed yourself. Use you. Ian started school, started high school, online, showed up. You guys took care of the pets that we have you and you took care of each other. So I really appreciate you and that Thank you.

Ian O’Roarty 7:18
Thank you for the experience.

Casey O'Roarty 7:21
I said in the introduction that I mentioned that you and I are pretty close. How would you describe our relationship?

Ian O’Roarty 7:32
I guess they're pretty close to, I mean, like we can tell each other stuff, so not a lot of secrets or anything. So it's like a pretty open relationship, like you tell me what you want me to do. I tell you if you're kind of, like, even with the other day when you asked me if you're doing anything that makes me, like, annoyed, if you could do it better and just like, that kind of stuff is really nice. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 7:59
I have to, I have to share about that, so I'm writing a new program for parents everyone, the beta program of parenting for the season you're in. And as happens, when I'm deep in the parenting content creation, I get to reflect on myself and my own parenting. And I had this moment where I realized, God, you know, I'm definitely on the edge of burnout. I've been working a lot and caregiving, and, you know, being there for my kids. And I noticed that Ian seems to be my outlet for some angst. You know, my temper and my patience runs thin, and I noticed that I was kind of on your case a lot, and I acknowledge that, and you confirmed. And when I asked you, you know, what do you what are you noticing? What could I do different? Will you share what you told me?

Ian O’Roarty 8:57
Yeah, I said, like, a lot of times when you want me to do something, you kind of passive aggressive about it, like, if I'm watching TV, I can you don't want me to be just, like, too early in the day, you'll say that really need to be on right now. No, I might say, I mean, I'm enjoying it, and then you kind of get mad that I say that. So I think it would just help if you just said, like, what you meant, like, can you turn that off please? Kind of being really vague about it, you know,

Casey O'Roarty 9:25
yeah, you call me out when I am kind of beating around the bush, huh? One of the parents in my community was curious about what I do and like, anything that you can pinpoint that Dad and I do to help you feel close to us like, what is it about our family that and I mean, it's kind of an interesting question, right? Because you don't know anything other than our family, but you have, you know, we've had some pretty deep conversations. You've shared. You know you're not a perfect kid. You've made mistakes, just like every other human and you're. You've, as far as I know, most of them have been, you know, you've shared with us even when it's been really hard and scary to do. What is it about our relationship that that helps you know that you can share like that? Um,

Ian O’Roarty 10:16
probably they're just, we're like, we're really close. I mean, also the lockdown has helped a lot with that. But like, we play games together. We like, we do a lot together. And it's not just like you like us not having a good time and you making us do it. It's like, we want to do it, and we're there. And I don't know, just like, we're kind of not really just a family. We're, like, also kind of friends too. You know, we have, like, such a close relationship that it's okay. And if I do mess up and I tell you about it, you're not gonna, like, I mean, you will get mad, but like, you're not gonna get super, super mad at me and not talk to me, or, like, punish me super, super harshly. And like, you'll give me, like, a punishment that it's the crime, you know, like,

Casey O'Roarty 11:05
like, what kind of punishment? Like, what? Well, think I've ever punished you just

Ian O’Roarty 11:12
saying stuff like, I mean, yeah, I guess because you don't, you won't, you don't really ground me and Rowan, you don't, like, take our phones away, you just kind of help us, like, realize what we did wrong, and like, how it makes us feel because, like, whenever I say something is because, like, eating away at me, and I want to tell you, because I feel really bad about it, and I guess that's kind of the big reason.

Casey O'Roarty 11:35
Yeah, and you feel safe and sharing with me, yeah, and you've always been like that, like you've always been a kid where if something shifty or shady has gone down you, it's hard for you to hold it in your body. And so a release you. It seems like, you know, even as a young kid, one of the ways that you that you tend to kind of release that uncomfortable feeling or guilt or shame or whatever you're holding is to share with me like that's kind of always been something that the relief is better than anything like me being upset or disappointed. Is that accurate? Would you say? Yeah? Yeah.

You and Rowan are super close too, huh? And since you were super little, you've always been her biggest fan. And I remember when you used to make her sit with you on the bus every day, and Rowan was on the show a couple weeks ago talking about the last couple of years and her challenges with mental health. I How was that for you when she was going through all of her stuff? What was it like to be the little brother then?

Ian O’Roarty 12:56
I mean, it was pretty scary when, like, you guys were talking about sending her away to, like, live somewhere else, and like, all the things we had to do to make what, like, theater better. And so I just kind of had to keep my head down and keep, like, keep going and not really try, I try not to think about it. And so I'm like talking to her. We talked a little bit about it when that was happening. And, I mean, it was, it wasn't like, like, I was getting mad at her because, like, because, I mean, it was, like, her fault, but I wasn't putting the blame on her. And I feel like, I guess it was good learning experience, but, yeah, I just kind of kept my head down. Good

Casey O'Roarty 13:39
learning for you, like learning by the example your sister was setting or what? Yeah, and what about you know, because when one person's having a hard time in the family, it kind of rocks the whole family system. And I'm wondering, and actually, some of the parents in my community asked to like, how did you feel as the other kid, like did you feel seen? Did you feel like you mattered too? Did you feel like Daddy and I were available for you? What was your experience? Just of us and how you know what we did? Well, what we could have done better? Any thoughts on Well,

Ian O’Roarty 14:18
I just when that was happening you guys, you had to pay more attention to her. And I understand the test. So I just, I guess I kind of leaned on my friends a little bit more, and, like, I didn't rely on that, but that helped a lot. It's like, the like my whole friend group was, I mean, there for me. I didn't really tell them all about it, but I hung out with them more, instead of like, what I would be like hanging out with you guys are playing games, I'd be maybe having a friend over or playing basketball. Basketball helped a lot during that time, too, because I could just go out there listen to some music and put some shots up, you know. So

Casey O'Roarty 14:55
you never felt like, you know, resentful. Or upset by what we were like us helping, like focusing on Rowan? No,

Ian O’Roarty 15:06
not at all. Oh,

Casey O'Roarty 15:08
that makes me really glad to hear. I was a little nervous about asking that question honestly Ian, because I know that we were really consumed by what was happening with her. So that feels really good. And I'm I've always been really grateful you and I are a lot alike, and I have some unbelievable friends that throughout my life that I love, and I and you have accumulated some really important people in your life too, and that's amazing. I'm glad for you when I shared also that you were coming on one of the first comment that I got on the post was so funny. It cracked me up. This mom just wrote swearing screen time reading agreements. So I laughed, because I was like, huh, yeah, those are some things will you share about the messaging, like, I mean, let's start with swearing, right? Because, I mean, we're pretty loose, yeah, pretty loose in our house around swearing. Will you share about the messaging like, the what kind of you've learned over time from me, and I guess just from me about swearing in our house, what's our

Ian O’Roarty 16:26
well, so like, really, I learned that. I mean, it's not really that big of a deal when you swear for most words and stuff like the big ones, like F word, you know, you don't want to, don't want to say that a lot, but it's a lot different when you're directing it at someone. Because if you're saying, like, hey, F you, that's a lot different than if you, like, smack your toe on the wall and you're like, oh shit. Like, that was, it's a lot different, you know, yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 16:52
but I mean, like, as you were, because I remember, I remember you being a little boy, and you were, and the word idiot, like you loved saying the word idiot, which is not a swear word, right? But when your kids are little, and you'll find out one day, hopefully, if you're a dad, if you want to be a dad, you'll find out that even the words that aren't necessarily swear words are really hard to hear your sweet little baby boy spewing out. And so I remember we were camping, and I just remember being like, you know what? You can go on the camper, and you can say idiot as much as you want. You cannot say it around the fire out here. Do you remember that? No, you were little. Yeah, you were little. But it's kind of always been our policy, like, you know, time and place our family. So this is not the rule. So listeners, you get to decide about swearing in your house, but our family, you know, we're pretty the swear words are words. They're descriptive words. Sometimes they're really useful in making a point, and sometimes they're overkill, right? Yeah. And lately, you know what's been happening lately? And you share,

Ian O’Roarty 18:08
um, well, yeah, so sometimes I get screwed up, or when we're playing family games, and my like, Yelp out of swear word in a while. Yeah, I mean, I direct it at anyone or, like, use it hurtfully, but, yeah, I do let that slip a couple times. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 18:30
and we get to, we talk about, like, is this going to be, do we want this to be a habit? Do you want, like, no, rein it in. Rein it in. It's time and place, right?

Ian O’Roarty 18:41
Yeah, time and place that's, I mean, it's different, like, swearing around your friends, because obviously pantime runs in, so it's a lot different. But you gotta have what's, what do you say a lot. So, right? Like, what's the situational awareness? Situational awareness, yeah, yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 18:58
Because if you get in the habit of swearing and all of a sudden you're at Nana and grandpa's and fuck flies out of your mouth. Not so great, right? So a lot of people have screen time questions for you too, Ian, and we'll get to that. But I also appreciated that this same parent asked about reading agreements. So talk to me and share with everybody about like, where you and I are currently with reading for pleasure,

Ian O’Roarty 19:30
really? I mean, I like to read when I find a good book, but I'm very unmotivated to find that said good book. So, yeah, take some motivation. But once I get into it, I get into it. But when I'm not, you definitely do get on my case. A lot about reading, and eventually, like, like, in the past, like, month, I've read two books and in the span of two days, because they were really good books. And then the third one is. Pretty good too, but I just stopped reading for some reason.

Casey O'Roarty 20:04
Yeah, so we don't have, like, a particular reading agreement, but reading is something that Rowan does a lot of. I mean, it's something we value in our family. We love a good book. Everybody's a good reader. So it's not something that you struggle with, and I, I know, for me, it feels like perhaps the little screen, aka the phone, you know, kind of messes with attention span and messes gets in the way of that other way of consuming content, which is through a good book. But you know what I'm hearing you say is, find the good book, right? Find the good book and, and it's that without willingness, is there? What's the name of those books that you guys just read? Because Rowan, Rowan recommended it, right? Do you know the name of it? No, don't. Okay, well, look in the show notes listeners, and I'll make sure that Rowan pops them in, because both of you have kind of flown through the series, okay, screen time. So full disclosure, things are pretty loose over here. We are not super rigid. I don't think we're super rigid on screen time. And I also acknowledge that I've put limits on Ian's phone and our Wi Fi shuts down at a certain time. So, you know, I don't feel like we're very strict, but maybe I should just let you describe your experience of screen time at our house. Ian, yeah,

Ian O’Roarty 21:31
well, I mean, I do feel like you are pretty strict about like the limits and like the Wi Fi, because just based on, like, my experience. I know I have some friends who, like is, I mean, obviously I don't want to spend like, this much time on my phone, because it would make me feel gross. But I have friends who spend like, seven or eight hours on their phone a day, which is just, I mean, it's just crazy to me and like that would just make me feel gross. Because, like, I like to be active, I like to do stuff, but, yeah, I usually I don't spend that much time on my phone because I'm also using other screens, like watching TV is the other main thing I do. But yeah, so the phone and the TV is basically it's me I don't play many video games, so that's not really something we have to worry a lot about, though it did in the past.

Casey O'Roarty 22:25
Yeah. And so the limits that we have on your phone, we I use that screen, the Apple screen time, and limit the amount of time you can be on your phone. I think, do I? Does it work? Yeah,

Ian O’Roarty 22:42
I don't usually get to those limits anyways, because you put four hours on it, and I usually only do, like, two and a half hours of my phone, three hours lately, yeah. I mean, for I was like, yeah, we've been

Casey O'Roarty 22:56
through some peak experiences, yeah. And the TV has kind of become with your dad right now, it's just kind of our gathering place. Yeah, and I feel like just full transparency to listeners, I feel like we watch way too much TV, and I also recognize we're all in the room together, we're laughing, we're talking, we're having a shared experience. So I'm kind of letting that go a little bit. We did watch the social dilemma. Remember that documentary? What did you think about that? Yeah,

Ian O’Roarty 23:29
I thought that was interesting. It made me realize, like, how much time I spend on my phone. So after that, I deleted Tiktok, right? And did

Casey O'Roarty 23:39
you learn? Yeah, what did you learn new watching that movie, maybe, or what like was really, maybe, were there things that maybe you kind of knew, but then watching that movie realized, like, whoa.

Ian O’Roarty 23:51
I mean, I guess because I pretty much knew, like, all about, like, the algorithm that the app used, and like, yeah, it just, it just kind of brought it to light. You know,

Casey O'Roarty 24:06
you also delete so you got rid of Tiktok. Why?

Ian O’Roarty 24:09
Because I just realized how much time I waste on it. It is a bottomless pit of Yeah. And I did. I re downloaded it last week, and the day I downloaded it, I had three days of screen time down that week, and they were at like, an hour and 30 minutes each, and then I downloaded Tiktok, and my next day was four hours. Oh, suck me back in.

Casey O'Roarty 24:37
You recently deleted your snapchat account too and started a new one. And you went through and cleared up your Instagram. Will you talk What motivated you? Well?

Ian O’Roarty 24:47
So I, as you said, play basketball. And so there's like this guy that I see on social media. His name is Dior Johnson. He's a high. School basketball player, and he talks a lot about, or he doesn't talk a lot about, but like, I noticed he only follows four people, and he, like, on his post, he like, talks about him, like being focused. And so it kind of made me think, like, you know, I waste a lot of time on my phone when I could be doing other stuff. And like, I guess it's hard for me to focus, because I think about what I'm missing out on, I guess, or I want to do something else. So I unfollowed like 800 people. So now I only follow, I only follow the people who I care about, and a couple like sports media pages. So I only follow 24 people now, and on my Snapchat, I made another account because I realized I have a lot of people in my snapchat that I some of them I didn't even know. So even like the people I do know now, I don't even like add them back. I only have 23 people added, and there's those are the people who I'm like, closest with and like, I don't even I don't even I don't Snapchat. Most of them I'm Snapchat like, three or four people a day, and it definitely keeps me like, my head clear, keeps me level headed and like, helps me focus.

Casey O'Roarty 26:17
Yeah, the grown ups often are worried about what the kids are, who they're following on social media, what they're seeing, and kids, you know, if anyone listening, was part of the teens and screens mini Summit, we talked a lot about just the some of the messages, and that kids can have secret accounts. And I remember when, you know, Rowan first got into social media, and I was privy to some of what she followed and seeing kids doing all the things, vaping and doing drugs and like partying and and it's scary for the adults, because we, you know, I mean, it was one thing when we were kids, and rarely would we be inundated and see all of that stuff. We had to be present with the person doing it to see it. You will. You share a little bit about kind of your experience with that. Yeah.

Ian O’Roarty 27:16
So I mean, also, another reason basketball has helped me is like, it gave me like, a goal. Like goals and like, helped me focus so, like, if I ever I can thinking, like, Huh? I wonder, like, what I like, what it be like if I got high, or like, I like, I want to, I kind of want to do drugs or like, something like that with a doubt, but I think to myself, like that, like interferes with sports, it like will take me out. Like my focus and like that kind of helps me keep a clear mind. And also, like with going through my Snapchat, and I'm adding a lot of people, I realized because how many people I follow and like, I see their stories and like, a lot of them do drugs. So I was like, and I cut off a lot of people in my life who did that kind of stuff, so that I could kind of surround myself with people who have similar goals, or not necessarily similar goals, but who have goals, so that I could, like, really just focus on what I want to do.

Casey O'Roarty 28:21
That's awesome. I really admire you for that. Ian, I think that's really cool. And I also know that, you know, being a teenager is a wild time, and curiosity sometimes gets the better of us, and it feels really good to trust that you are, you know, in your decision making, not only are you pretty level headed, but even when you because sometimes you're not. And when you make mistakes, you seem to really learn from them, you know. And it seems like when you make mistakes, sometimes there's been a couple things that have happened where you've said to me, like, I'm actually kind of glad that happened, because now I know how bad it feels to do that, and I'm not going to do that again. And I think that's, I think that's bigger learning than me being like, don't you ever do this thing, right? So, um, you're not a gamer, like you said, but there have been times where you've been you got into video games. And so I want to talk about this just briefly, because a couple people asked, and I know there's people who have kids that are way into video games. We've always been, I've always been, honestly kind of paranoid, not wanting you to become super obsessed with video games. So we've been pretty strict around that. Can you talk a little bit about like, when you've been really into it, and just kind of how it felt?

Ian O’Roarty 29:56
Yeah? So, yeah. At the first time I really got into video games was, like, probably a year or not a year, like six months after we got to PS four. And

Casey O'Roarty 30:07
I don't know why I got that. I let me tell you why I got that. I thought we could all play Fortnite at the same time. I did not realize only one at a time could play it. So I thought, oh, fam, the family. It's something a family could do together. No, go on, yeah.

Ian O’Roarty 30:21
So all my friends were playing Fortnite, and then I magically got a PS four, then Easter. So I started playing Fortnite, and I got really into it, and I was not very good, so it was frustrating when I had to stop playing, because, like, more you play, but you get so you get it, like, I wasn't getting that much better, and it was kind of annoying. And I did not like that. You set limits, but I'm glad you did, looking back on it, yeah, why? Because it helped me. Like, after a while, I just stopped playing because, I mean, I was not very good, and also I had better things to do than just sit look at the screen and move some controls around

Casey O'Roarty 31:05
for a minute. You really wanted a gaming computer. I remember you were like, I want to build a gaming computer. And I remember just to be transparent to the people listening. I remember I was like, Oh heck no, this is not happening. We're not going to have a special chair. We're not going to have a special a special computer, because you had, up until that point, always been super active, sporty, wanting to be outside, doing, moving your body. And I was really scared of falling into that hole of and now he does is want to play video games, and so I wanted to keep the video gaming pretty light. And yeah, it was interesting with Fortnite, because I remember having a lot of conversations with you, and like, you would watch YouTube videos of people playing Fortnite and and I remember saying to you, like, Well, this guy is really good at Fortnite, because Fortnite is all he does. That's all he does. And trying to help you see, like you like to do this thing and this thing and this thing and this thing and this thing and play Fortnite was that, I mean, you were younger. You were probably, how old do you think you were at this point, like 10 or 11 or 12. I

Ian O’Roarty 32:21
think it was like 11, yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 32:23
yeah. Was that useful? Do you remember me pointing that out, or was it just annoying?

Ian O’Roarty 32:33
It might have been useful, but I'm pretty sure it's just annoying.

Casey O'Roarty 32:38
In the moment, super annoying. Looking back, really useful. Remember that? Okay, yeah, there will be other things in life from me that will seem annoying at the time. And now you play Fortnite every once in a while, but you find yourself like you have fun with it. It seems like it's light, like you'll, yeah, meet up with friends from our old town. And, yeah,

Ian O’Roarty 33:00
you know, I did that for a while, like I would get on it every month or so, but I did get on it, it was not very I mean, it was fun, like being with my friends, but it was not very fun, because when you play once a month, you're not good, and when you're not good, all you do is sit there and watch once You get

Casey O'Roarty 33:20
killed, getting killed by eight year olds.

Ian O’Roarty 33:23
I deleted it off the piss for two days ago. Oh, because it's taking up a lot of storage. Oh, well,

Casey O'Roarty 33:31
good job. Way to notice that, because I did not know how that thing works. So with online school, right? Because you're, I mean, the screens are just everywhere. With online school and everything, how would you say that you're managing your screen time, like when you take an honest look? You know, are there things that screen time gets in the way of, or are you feeling right now pretty good about your balance that you're creating.

Ian O’Roarty 34:01
I mean, like, compared to what it would normally be, I am on my screens for the majority of the day, whether it's looking at my computer or my phone or the TV. Like I'm on it. I'm on screens for most of the day if I'm like, because the only other things I do is play basketball or work out or get go on a walk or jot

Casey O'Roarty 34:21
or play a board game.

Ian O’Roarty 34:24
Yes, that's, that's, but, uh, like, if it was normally, I could, I could be out doing a lot more things like meeting up with friends or going to the gym. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 34:35
yeah. So, right here, right now, in the context of 2020, covid online school. There's a lot of screen going on, but do you feel like you have a pretty healthy relationship with your screens?

Ian O’Roarty 34:49
Yeah. I mean, I'm not on my phone that much like after school. I'll just, I'll probably I stretch and then I go upstairs and play basketball if it's not rain. Outside, then I come back inside and do a workout, and then sit in the hot tub. What

Casey O'Roarty 35:08
do you do? Mostly on your phone. What do you do? Thing? Well,

Ian O’Roarty 35:12
it's like 10% like Snapchatting my friends, and then all the rest is on Instagram because my feed is mostly basketball. I just look at basketball highlights on my phone Well, and

Casey O'Roarty 35:29
what I hope we are highlighting Ian, and I want to say thank you again for coming on, because you being willing to talk candidly with me makes an impact on the people that are listening, and I want everyone to notice, like the way that Ian and I are talking about screens, and I want to highlight that we haven't had any defensiveness show up in our conversation. Ian and I think a lot of people right now, even bringing up their kids screen or social media use, like, there's a lot of tension that parents and teens have, even in having a conversation around like, hey, it seems like you're on your phone a lot. And Which isn't to say that there's never tension between us, because there, there definitely has been. But we talk about screens all the time, right? And I'm pretty open with my own struggle with screens. Is that, do you think that that helps create an environment where we can talk to each other without getting all worked up? Yeah,

Ian O’Roarty 36:34
because, I mean, you are on your phone just as much as I am, but, but you're not, you're not doing the same things I am, but you definitely the same amount, so I can, kind of, like, get on your case too. So that helps, yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 36:51
does it help that we're kind of like, I'm not holding myself on on a pedestal, like I'm so great at managing screens and you suck, yeah? One Mom, this is an interesting one, and full disclosure. Well, I'll tell you the full disclosure in a minute. One mom mentions that she doesn't allow devices in the bedroom at all, and she didn't mention like devices in the bedroom overnight, or devices in the bedroom like ever so I'm going to read it as if she doesn't allow any phones in bedrooms ever, and her son, who's your age, is always pushing against that, meaning he's he wants it in his room, or maybe he takes it in any way. What do you think about that? And again, everyone, full disclosure, Ian has a desktop computer in his room, a school laptop and a phone, often all at the same time in his room. So, you know, we definitely have had evolving limits on screens. It's been an evolution. It hasn't, you know, we didn't start off with three different screens that had access to the internet in his room, but like, that's where we are right now. What do you think about that limit of no screens, no devices in the bedrooms? At as someone with someone who's 15,

Ian O’Roarty 38:16
I usually I don't even really use my phone. Went to my room, because when I'm doing school, I have it over here, I noticed that I'm checking it quite a lot, so usually I just turn around and throw it on my bed, because then I'm like, oh, where's my phone? I want to pick it up, and that's always on my bed. I'm like, and I might too far away. So that's how I handle my phone. And then on my desktop during school, I used to just have music playing, and then my school computer as, like, the school is monitoring it, so I, like, it doesn't get YouTube or, like, any, like, really,

Casey O'Roarty 38:54
any sketch,

Ian O’Roarty 38:55
any insights on it, yeah, so I can't, like, watch YouTube or like, cool math games. A big deal to school. No cool,

Casey O'Roarty 39:08
no cool math games. Well, and I guess, you know, I'm guessing that this parent is coming from that place of, you know, it's the internet is like wide open spaces and there's plenty of scary, gross stuff that kids can find. And, you know, for a long time, the desktop computer was in our living room. And so anytime the kids, you know, when the kids were young, if they were getting on the computer, there was always somebody kind of around, and it was obvious what they were checking out. And as they've gotten older, and we've been through, you know, some different experiences and different challenges, and grown to trust the kids and really assess how they are holding our values and what their use looks like. I mean, you wouldn't. Have all those screens in your room if I didn't trust that you were using them appropriately. And you know, when I say appropriately, I also want to say, Remember everyone who's listening when we were teenagers and we wanted to have a conversation with our best friend or our boyfriend or our girlfriend, like, who wanted to do that in the middle of the family room, not me, you know, and then remembering, like when talking to somebody on the family phone and having somebody else in the house and Ian, you don't even know what this is like, but you know, if there's four phones in the house, it's all the same line. So if I was talking to my friend in my room, and, you know, my mom picked it up in the kitchen. She could, if she was real quiet, pick it up and listen to everything I was saying. So, yeah, right. I mean, I'm sure she never did that. And then they got me my own line, which I think was a disaster, but that's kind of like what you guys have. You have your own lines. You have your own devices for communicating with your friends. So, you know, I just want to say to the mom with the 15 year olds, I would say, Listen. Listen to his, you know, listen to his argument. Listen to his why? Listen to like his. You know, what he how he feels about the boundary of no devices in the bedroom, and really listen from a place of curiosity and remembering that there has to be an opportunity for our kids to practice managing themselves without us hovering without limits that are so strict that they don't allow for management. So what would you what do you think? Do you think that that makes sense? Ian, yeah, I do. And when mistakes are made, like earlier on, you said, I punish you, which I don't punish you, but sometimes, sometimes when mischief happens, there are limits that become a little bit tighter, right?

Ian O’Roarty 41:59
Yeah, that's kind of what I meant by Okay, so

Casey O'Roarty 42:03
let's shift into something else. I am curious, and so are others. So right now, you're a 15 year old boy, and a lot of parents right now because of just wanting to grow ever better men and the ME TOO movement, we're super hypersensitive about wanting to make sure that our sons develop healthy masculinity. What does masculinity mean to you? Or if it's easier to think of it like, what does it mean like to be a good man? What does that mean to you,

Ian O’Roarty 42:36
respecting women and respecting yourself and being yourself?

Casey O'Roarty 42:43
Yeah?

Ian O’Roarty 42:44
Yeah. I mean, I don't really know what to say to that question besides that, because, I mean, there can be stuff like it used to be, what does mean? Be men, be strong, provide that kind of thing. And I mean, that's still true, but it's not necessarily just men can do that.

Casey O'Roarty 43:04
Have you had in your experience in the last couple years at school and stuff does, does like toxic masculinity? Is that something that comes up in conversations?

Ian O’Roarty 43:13
Oh, yeah, definitely a lot. Once I moved to Bellingham, Oh, tell me more all these. I mean, and Monroe is a lot different because, you know, there's like, as a different environment, Bellingham is more sensitive and more like, you would say, open minded, and so, like, the girl there was, like, there's, there's a couple girls at the middle school last year who would like, they were just always having really deep conversations. And so like, whenever I'd be around them, and then, like, if we ever got onto, like, the track of them talking about guys, they'd be like, Oh my God, there's such toxic masculinity. And they'd be like, just talking about that, and I just sit there and listen to what they had to say.

Casey O'Roarty 44:03
Did you learn anything?

Ian O’Roarty 44:06
Not, not really, anything I didn't already know. Like, don't be a dick, don't like ghost people. Don't do any of that kind of stuff. You know? Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 44:15
yeah. It seems like ever more boys and men are expected, and these are good things, right? But haven't necessarily been things that have been held as valuable for boys and men, but boys and men are expected to understand consent and how to respect women and how to stand up to jerks and what it means to shut it down when the conversation goes to a place of putting down women and girls. Do you feel a lot of pressure to be a certain way, or, does it? Is it something that you're, you know, just your easy going nature kind of takes in stride? Do you feel that pressure of like you have to be a good man, otherwise you're a jerk, or what? Yeah. Yeah,

Ian O’Roarty 45:00
well, I mean, I guess I got, kind of, I kind of take it inside, but also, I mean, for some people, because I don't really talk to a lot of people. I mean, I have, like, quite a bit of friends, but, but I don't really talk to many of them. And so when I do, I, like, I can be myself, and I'm not toxic. I'm a toxic person. So kind of easy to be a good man, quote, unquote, yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 45:26
Have you ever been in situations where and rent, granted, like, Yeah, you don't talk to a lot of people because we're in a pandemic, and you just get to talk to your family. Lucky you. But have you been in situations where there's conversations or things happening, where you feel pressured, like you should act a certain way, like you should join in, kind of talking smack about girls, or anything like that. Have you ever felt that kind of pressure or or not really,

Ian O’Roarty 45:53
but I'm with the boys. You know, it's a lot different, because, I mean, obviously, like you're not going to actually talk bad about people, like, talk bad about women. Like, that's just not something that happens. I guess at least the people that I've been around or like, we would joke like, we're not going to call like, we're not gonna be like, Oh, she's a she's a hoe, or anything. Like, we just don't talk about that kind of stuff. But like, we definitely will, like, joke around about people, you know, but like, not, not nothing too serious. It's all light, keep it light, right?

Casey O'Roarty 46:26
And have you ever had the experience where maybe somebody's crossed a line and you've had to speak up, or you, or maybe not spoken up and felt like, later on, like you should have. Have you ever had that experience?

Ian O’Roarty 46:38
I mean, some people will be like, like, say something, and then everyone, like, it just kind of is, like, offbeat, and it's a little too far. Everyone kind of looks at them and like they're it's just really awkward. And like, everyone knows that they cross the line, but no one says anything and he realizes what he's done. So like, he kind of take, tries to take it back. So, you know, it's kind of a collective not just after one person too. Yeah, while someone out, everyone calls them out. So

Casey O'Roarty 47:07
does it feel like, it feels like you've developed a group of friends who can, who know that there's lines? Oh, yeah, definitely. I'm glad about that. Do you feel pressure from me around this, like, how you show up in the world?

Ian O’Roarty 47:23
Yeah, I mean, obviously I am not going to disappoint my mom. Like, I'm not gonna

Casey O'Roarty 47:30
you well, it's okay. I can live through it. It'll

Ian O’Roarty 47:32
be fine if I do something I think, like, Would my parents prove this kind of, I kind of have that in the back of my head, so I'm not going to do anything that takes anything too far, you know, yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 47:44
well, and I think even more than that, and I think you've this is something that I've noticed about you too. Is like, is this something that I want to have to come clean on? That seems like that's been a good Gage for you too. I

You talked about basketball. How do you and somebody actually asked me about this, like, how do you set goals? And you know, you've mentioned working out, and you know, there's not a lot of basketball togetherness happening, but you have goals about wanting to play college basketball and seeing how far you can go with it. How do you what's your process of setting goals and how do you meet them?

Ian O’Roarty 48:32
Um, the only goals I really have is, I mean, obviously, I want to make Varsity Basketball as soon as I can, whether that's this year next year. And as far as, like, working out and getting better, I just do as much as I can to get better every day. I work out one or two times a day to just get better, get as like, in the best shape I can. Like, sometimes I go for run. Sometimes, like, Oh,

Casey O'Roarty 48:58
you've gone for like, three runs. Come on. Let's keep it real. No,

Ian O’Roarty 49:01
I feel for runs more than that. Do you? Yeah?

Casey O'Roarty 49:06
Okay, sorry, my bad.

Ian O’Roarty 49:07
I'm sorry. I'll shoot. I'll shoot the ball every day. I'll try to do like 500 shots a day. I'll do ball hands and then work out I come inside. I try to do legs as much as I can. I i Just do as much as I can to achieve, like, because my long term goal is obviously, like, I obviously, I want to play professional basketball, and I'm not going to make that happen, but I don't work, and so I know very slim chance that I do, but I'm going to do as much as I can to make that happen.

Casey O'Roarty 49:39
Yeah. Do you have any goals around school? I

Ian O’Roarty 49:43
just want to get good grades. How do you and what does

Casey O'Roarty 49:47
that look like to you? As far as like achieving that, what are your processes? What are your routines around making sure that you pay

Ian O’Roarty 49:55
attention in class, do all the work they sign like that. Be for tests and, yeah, do you

Casey O'Roarty 50:04
have, like, somewhere where you write things down, like, what are the kind of tangible, practical things that you do, even if it's basketball, like, Do you have a schedule? Is it a certain time of day? Is there anything like that that helps you kind of keep track of where you're at and what your progress is

Ian O’Roarty 50:22
for school, it's kind of just like, I could check skyward and see my grades, and I can check Microsoft Teams and see the assignments I have to do. And for basketball, it's just like, I mean, I guess I have a schedule because, I mean, as far as, like, we're in winter right now, so it's raining a lot. So if it's not raining, I'm going to be outside and be playing, like, be shooting and that kind of stuff. And so like, I'll do that. It's kind of structured around, like, when it's light outside, because it gets dark at like, four, and so like, after four, I'll probably do my workout after it gets dark, and I stretch in the morning and at night, right right as I wake up and right before bed, and I just kind of try to do everything in the most convenient time. And if it's not convenient, I'll still try to get it done. You

Casey O'Roarty 51:16
are very motivating, Ian, with how focused you are right now, especially on basketball. And not only are you focused on basketball, but you're getting school done. Like I said to you recently. You know, I think one of the gifts of everything that Dad's going through is that I'm distracted by it like there's stuff other things for me to be focused on than hovering around missing assignments and tardies and those kinds of things. And you know, you've really, like, you're the one that's emailing your teachers, and you're you're really taking the reins and making what you want to make happen in school, and I want to acknowledge you for that. And I'm wondering, like, do you feel abandoned? Or, do you does it feel good that I'm not, like, all up in your business, or could I be up in your business a little bit more? Like, how do you feel about that? I

Ian O’Roarty 52:13
feel like it's fine, just how it is you not being my business that much all they do, like, check skyward once in a while and, like, ask me about stuff it that is good to, like, have that little sense of, like, I had to get this done because, like, I mean, not just because you're going to look at it and then ask me about it later, but because I want to get it done for myself. You know, how do you like driving? Yeah, I like it a lot.

Casey O'Roarty 52:42
Ian has his driver's permit, and none of us can go anywhere with him, volunteering without him, volunteering to come and drive.

Ian O’Roarty 52:48
Yep, I just want to practice. Yeah. How

Casey O'Roarty 52:52
does that practice feel? Because you had had some practice in the neighborhood, and then it was time to take it next level, out in the road. Like, what does it feel like? Because it's been a long time since I was a new driver, 30 years. How does it what does it feel like to be brand new behind the wheel? I

Ian O’Roarty 53:13
mean, well, I mean as I probably have a different experience than most other people, because I did get to drive in the neighborhood about, like, not just like, not just like, a minute at a time, but like, I would go for like, 2030, minute drives with dad, because our neighborhood is huge, and so we'd go around in the different gates, and I would get a lot of practice. So transitioning from that to like, the actual roads is pretty

Casey O'Roarty 53:40
easy. Wow, even with all those other cars, yeah,

Ian O’Roarty 53:44
I mean, obviously in town, it's a little bit different, because I don't have as much experience. I like stoplights and that kind of thing, but it is pretty easy. Transit transitioning. I don't feel like I'm in the dark and like I I'm not really frantic when I'm behind the wheel, you know? Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 54:01
I appreciate that about you. You feel cautious. It feels like you're paying attention, even as you are a brand new baby, baby driver, and it's nice that you're my second kid, because it was terrifying for my first kid. Um, okay, well, on behalf of the whole community, Ian and myself. Thank you. Thank you for being open to coming on and talking to me about all the things.

Ian O’Roarty 54:26
Thank you. Problem.

Casey O'Roarty 54:28
I love it. I love you. Love you too. So I ask all of my guests this, and you are my guest. When you hear joyful courage, what does that mean to you?

Ian O’Roarty 54:39
When I have joyful courage, I think about you and I think about your company, yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 54:45
what do you think that i What do you think about when you think about the work that I do? I

Ian O’Roarty 54:50
mean, I think it's cool you're helping people. So, yeah, it's cool, good that you're providing people with the tool, yeah, tools to manage their children.

Casey O'Roarty 54:59
Do you ever think, Geez, my mom should, shouldn't be the shouldn't is a freak. She shouldn't be teaching people what she can't do. Do you ever feel like I don't do what I say, what I talk about, or anything like that? Not

Ian O’Roarty 55:14
really. Sometimes I'm mad at you. I think, like this lady thinks she can teach other people. But yeah, I did. I ever tell you that one of my substitutes I was really mad at me telling a story? Alright? So well, maybe not the whole story, but yeah, so my my substitute teacher is mad at me because I was talking bit in class. She put me in the corner, and I was doing my work, and she came over and she asked me, start talking to me, and she asked me, What do your parents do for a living? And I was like, my dad is a power lineman, and my mom has a company. And she's like, Oh, what's your mom's company? And I said, See, her company's called dreadful courage, and she teaches positive discipline. Positive Discipline depends. She goes, Oh, well, you should tell your mom. Then she needs to know how to manage your own kid before she starts telling other people how to do it. And I just laughed at her, and then a couple other people, because she was like, harassing students all day, the man that couple other people went to the principal's office, and she got fired.

Casey O'Roarty 56:26
Way to advocate for yourself, babe, way to shut her down.

Ian O’Roarty 56:30
She got fired. And then the principals I teach us the day. Great. Very cool.

Casey O'Roarty 56:37
Well, thank you for your time. Ian, I know you'd rather be out shooting hoops, probably, and it's not raining, so my guess is you'll be heading out there. I love you. Thank you. Love it too.

Ian O’Roarty 56:47
Thank you for having me on.

Casey O'Roarty 56:56
Yay. Thank you for listening. Friend. If you have any questions or feedback, please reach out. Let me know what you need at [email protected] I promise I read each and every email I get. If you're needing more support, consider signing up for one of my courses or one on one coaching head to joyfulcurge.com and dig around to find out the best fit for you. Next week, we will be taking a much needed break here at joyful courage. I will be back with the first show of 2021 on january 4. I am so so excited to serve you in the new year. I will be unveiling the first mini summit of 2021 during that episode, as well as some other goodies that I am scheming on for you. Listen. I just want to point out too, that the podcast does not pay for itself. I have a team of people that put this puppy together, an amazing editor to make sure the sound is as good as it can be in your ears, an awesome project manager who does all the things to get the show notes written and the episodes out into the world. And I pay them. Speaking of puppies, can you hear that I pay them to do that work? A powerful way that you can give back and support the show is by being a part of the Patreon community, the patrons make a small monthly contribution, and all of it is put towards creating the podcast. Patrons also get perks like live monthly calls with me and live streams of solo shows. It's cool, and now, if you're new to Patreon, you can opt to pay one annual payment rather than monthly, and enjoy all the perks, the best of which is knowing you are helping me make an impact on families. So I want you to go over to patreon.com/joyful, courage. That's P, A, T, R, e o n.com/joyful, courage to check out more. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Love you, love you, love you. Happy Holidays, and I will see you in the new year. Peace out. 2020,

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