Eps 411: Adulting update with my girl Rowan

Episode 411

I’m so excited about my guest today, Rowan O’Roarty, my daughter!  

Rowan is back and shares updates on what’s been going on since last time she was on, like working as an esthetician and moving out & living on her own.  We talk about how often we check-in with each other, how Rowan’s anxiety & depression are showing up recently, and how she manages them.  She shares her thoughts on how parents can best support their adolescents and young adults when they’re struggling with depression.  Rowan ends by sharing a poem about motherhood that resonated with her recently.  

Guest Description 

Rowan is my daughter! She is 20 years old and a friend to the podcast. Many of you have followed our experiences for the last few years. You got to listen to Rowan speak about her mental health journey the end of 2020 on Episode 252, then she came back with an update the following year in 2021 on Episode 306.

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Takeaways from the show

  • Job interviews
  • Moving out
  • How frequently should we check-in with each other?
  • Managing anxiety & depression
  • Supporting adolescents & young adults with depression
  • What emerging adults need/want from their parents

What does joyful courage mean to you

Joyful courage is getting out of bed when you’re depressed and taking out the trash because it stinks.

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I know that you love listening every week AND I want to encourage you to dig deeper into the learning with me, INVEST in your parenting journey. Casey O'Roarty, the Joyful Courage podcast host, offers classes and private coaching. See our current offerings.


feel, love, talk, spa, parents, experience, depression, rowan, good, interview, kids, work, rohan, year, life, space, texting, esthetician, hearing, week
Rowan O'Roarty, Casey O'Roarty

Casey O'Roarty 00:04
Hey, welcome to the joyful courage podcast a place for inspiration and transformation as we try and keep it together, while parenting our tweens and teens. This is real work people. And when we can focus on our own growth, and nurturing the connection with our kids, we can move through the turbulence in a way that allows for relationships to remain intact. My name is Casey already, I am your fearless host. I'm a positive discipline trainer, space holder coach and the adolescent lead at Sprout double. I am also the mama to a 20 year old daughter and 17 year old son walking right beside you on this path of raising our kids with positive discipline and conscious parenting. This show is meant to be a resource to you and I work really hard to keep it real, transparent and authentic so that you feel seen and supported. Today is an interview and I have no doubt that what you hear will be useful to you. Please don't forget sharing truly is caring. If you love today's show, please pass the link around snap a screenshot posted on your socials or texted to your friends. Together we can make an even bigger impact on families all around the globe. I'm so glad that you're here. Enjoy the show.

Casey O'Roarty 01:25
All right. Hey, everybody. I'm so excited about my guest today. My guest today. My guest is Rohan over already. Rohan is my daughter. Here she is now 20 years old, a good friend to the podcast many of you have followed our experiences. For the last few years what she's been willing to allow me to share, you got to listen to Rowan speak about her mental health journey at the end of 2020 on Episode 252, then she came back with an update the following year, Episode 306. And now it's a year and a half later, and Rowan the community has been asking for another update. So I'm really honoured and excited that you're willing to come to the show again. And let us in on your experience of life as an emerging baby adult. Hi, welcome back to the podcast. Hi. Hello. So fill in the gaps a little bit. What are the big highlights since you were last on at the start, which was like the start of 2021? What's been going down?

Rowan O'Roarty 02:43
I think it was a little bit into 2021. Right because I was in aesthetics school.

Casey O'Roarty 02:48
I think you were maybe getting ready to start esthetician school? Or maybe you were in it. Oh yeah. No,

Rowan O'Roarty 02:57
I think I was in it or done or something. So I'm a licenced esthetician. I work in a spa. And I love what I do. I do facials and waxing. And I love what I do. And I moved out four or five months ago, I started taking some college classes. Yeah, I'm basically living life now. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 03:20
you're adulting you're adulting

Rowan O'Roarty 03:23
I'm adulting. And I'm pretty fucking good at it. You feel good about? Yeah, I'm pretty good at it. Are

Casey O'Roarty 03:31
you surprised that you're good at it?

Rowan O'Roarty 03:32
No, but took me by surprise that I was but I'm not surprised. You know what I mean? Yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 03:39
Well, let's go back a little bit because yeah, you finished esthetician school? You thought at the end of that, that maybe you didn't want to be an esthetician. Remember those days? Yes. And then tried. A couple other things wanted to work.

Rowan O'Roarty 04:00
Yeah, I think dropping out of high school made me like, since I didn't go the traditional way from high school to college. I don't know. I think that that played a part in me, being like, I need to find a career, but also not meaning to find a career. But also, like, there's so many options out there. I just want to do everything. I want to try everything. And so yes, I graduated Beauty School, and then I was a receptionist for a second and then I went back to college because I thought I wanted to be a journalist like writer. And then I got a job in a spa, and was like a cleaning person and the spa for a second and then now in a couple of weeks I will be on my one year anniversary of doing aesthetics at the spa.

Casey O'Roarty 04:52
Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah, talk a little bit about your interview. I love this story with The spa like your initial interview, they called you, you'd filled out a bunch of applications on what like indeed? Or what's the

Rowan O'Roarty 05:08
well, actually, yeah, I was on indeed looking for jobs for a long time. And actually, I just like randomly came across. I work at the chrysalis and I randomly came across it. And I sent them an email with my resume and cover letter. That's it. And then a few months later, I get a call asking me if I want to come interview. And I was like, Whoa, sure. Like, oh, this interview, I look suck. He'll

Casey O'Roarty 05:34
I wasn't home that day, which I think in the end was a good thing. Okay,

Rowan O'Roarty 05:39
yes. And I was wearing like, really cute black jeans, they had little rip in each knee to seal it off. And I went in there, and I interviewed and it was great. And I heard back. And the director of the SPA was basically like, Listen, you interviewed great, it was great. I just can't give you the job. Because you showed up with with jeans, basically, like you looked unprofessional. And I was like, Oh, shit, like, Oh, my God,

Casey O'Roarty 06:11
in that first message? Did she offer a redo?

Rowan O'Roarty 06:14
Um, I don't remember. But I remember bringing it to you and being like, after interviewing there, I was like, I want to work there. I want to do it better again. And so I emailed her back, and I was like, look like I would love the opportunity to interview again, with appropriate clothing. Please, like when you can? And she was like, of course, yes. I would love to do a redo. And so we did one later that week, and me and you went shopping for slack. Okay, dress pants people. Slack, get your kids some slack. Needs some slacks. And so we did that. And I went to the interview, and I liked boss. I like colour. And boom, got the job.

Casey O'Roarty 07:06
Yeah. How do you think that would have turned out? If I had been home that first day and made a comment about your outfit?

Rowan O'Roarty 07:15
Arguing? I probably wouldn't have felt confident in myself. Yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 07:19
I think that's so important to share with people because I definitely would have had something to say. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It would have been so hard for me not to have something to say. And that yeah, would have been an argument. And you feeling a certain way. And I've said to that spa director because I've met her multiple times. Yeah, well, and I've said to her, I just think it's such a gift for her to recognise you as a young person who has very limited experience in the interview process for her to give you a second chance. Like that was such a kind thing to do. And I'm so glad that she did that. And they

Rowan O'Roarty 08:00
love you there too. They love me, I love them. It was great. She was like I yeah, I really wanted to give you another chance. You don't know until you go through that, like kids aren't taught nowadays to be professional. And I was 19 in a professional setting, which not a tonne of 19 year olds are in professional settings. And you don't know how to dress for a professional setting until you get the opportunity to and she was like, I just really appreciate that you wanted to come back and that you showed up for this and stuff. And I was like, Girl, of course.

Casey O'Roarty 08:37
Well, and I also think there's power to hearing it from someone other than your parent. And you knew you wanted. Yeah. And I really loved that she started with how much she enjoyed you and how much she wanted to hire you. You know, I think that we talk a lot about that with positive discipline like connecting before correcting or redirecting, like she just did that and was encouraging. And yeah, so cool. Totally. Yeah. So fast forward march of this year. You move out. You're living in an apartment, you're paying your bills and feeding yourself. Oh, yeah. What's been the most surprising thing about being on your own?

Rowan O'Roarty 09:15
How much I love the clean. It's like Jesus put down for a second.

Casey O'Roarty 09:22
Okay. Honestly, though, like to keep your space tidy?

Rowan O'Roarty 09:25
I do. Yeah. I like to do the dishes at the end of every night and make sure the calories are clean. I don't know. Yeah. I wiped down the dishwasher for God's sake. I don't know. Yeah, that's probably the most surprising thing to me. But like, isn't that surprising? No, because who else is gonna do it?

Casey O'Roarty 09:47
Oh, man. All the parents are like hallelujah. Yes, exactly. Yeah.

Rowan O'Roarty 09:52
Amen. Amen. Listen, if your kids are doing stuff around the house, just wait because you're gonna Move out, and they're gonna be like, Oh, shit.

Casey O'Roarty 10:01
Well, and I think that's an important point to make. And it's something I've been talking about recently around chores and contributions and life skills. Right. And you know, you weren't a terrible contributor, but you weren't like, yeah, I want to do chores, you know, like, nourish your brother. And here you are on your own, in your own space with your own agenda. It has nothing to do with me, and you want to create a space that feels good to you. And I just think that's so important. And you have, you know, the wherewithal to do it. So parents as you think about your own kids, and whether or not they're helping out remember, you know, when it's not your agenda, it makes a big difference. What's been hard. What's been hard about living on your own. That's been

Rowan O'Roarty 10:51
you and dad texting me.

Casey O'Roarty 10:53
Tell me more. Like, sometimes I feel guilty. Tell me more.

Rowan O'Roarty 10:58
You guys text me a lot. Which I'm not saying this is the hardest thing about like now. But I mean, you're texting me every day. Dad's asking me to come over dinner, like five times a week? Yes. And it's like, I'm trying to. Yeah, and I appreciate. Like, I love you guys. And I appreciate you texting me all the time. I'm checking in. And I'm fine. Yeah. And I know you miss. And then you miss me at home. I know. Dad definitely misses me. I know y'all miss me. But it's like, I'm fine. Yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 11:42
So what I'm hearing is a request for a little more space. Yeah.

Rowan O'Roarty 11:48
I think we're getting a little better. Yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 11:50
Yeah. Yes. That's really important. Feedback. Rowan, I'm so glad that you brought this up on my podcast. Thanks for that.

Rowan O'Roarty 12:03
Real buddy, she's a loving parent.

Casey O'Roarty 12:05
She's a loving father. Well, and I think it's super real, you know? And I feel like, Yeah, I noticed for me, I do like to touch base with you every day? And is that allowing you to really be in that space? of, you know, quote on your own?

Rowan O'Roarty 12:26
Yeah. And I mean, I will, I don't mind it when you call me and stuff. Like for sure. I'm not saying like, stop contacting me. But just like, sometimes, it's almost like I'm at home. And I have the obligation to like, text you back. Right?

Casey O'Roarty 12:43
You know, that expectation? Is there? Yes.

Rowan O'Roarty 12:46
Yeah. And I'm like, no, like, I got stuck going.

Casey O'Roarty 12:51
Yes, yes. Oh, that's good. Thank you for that.

Casey O'Roarty 13:02
So on previous shows, and where you've shared, you've struggled a lot with anxiety, social anxiety. How's that? What's the update on anxiety and just being out in the world and relationships? How are you growing there? Yeah,

Rowan O'Roarty 13:18
anxieties gone? To be honest, for the most part,

Casey O'Roarty 13:22
amazing. Is that trippy to you? I've never had that experience. So is it kind of wild to look back and think about how cage Do you felt?

Rowan O'Roarty 13:31
It's relieving Yeah, that I can survive. And like not being in fight or flight all the time. Because, I mean, I still have like, I'll be in the store. And like, all of a sudden, there's a tonne of people in the aisle that I'm in. And I like, I talked to myself in the store out loud, loud, and not quiet. Like in a regular tone. And then like, it helps me do like, oh, avocados. Yeah, out loud. And just like, I'm just I feel like I'm verbally distracting myself. from getting too much in my head. Because it's just the grocery store. Everybody, it's just the grocery store. Where are used to having xiety? No, it's like, life. Yeah. Like, this is life. You have an awkward encounter. That's life. Maybe? Like,

Casey O'Roarty 14:25
yeah, and sometimes there's a lot of people in the aisle and you can pick a different aisle or manoeuvre through them or

Rowan O'Roarty 14:31
which I have no shame and walking halfway down the aisle and turning around. Yeah, yeah. knowing anything. I'm very personable. Yeah, being in adults. Like on my own. I definitely am able to make conversation easy. Just like all the time, which is nice. That's amazing. Oh, no, like, I'll go to the grocery store. I get my groceries for the week. The like, do you want bags? I'm like, Yeah, I need it. Carrie, what's up, my apartment stirs. And they're like, hi, I feel you.

Casey O'Roarty 15:04
So there's some banter. Like, it sounds like what I'm hearing you say is you feel like you can connect with people.

Rowan O'Roarty 15:09
Oh, yeah. I mean, yeah, I'm like, much more calm, cool and collected now.

Casey O'Roarty 15:15
So what about, you know, the other thing that you've struggled with depression, which kind of comes and goes talk a little bit about, you know, I know you had a recent little spell, talk about how you're taking care of your mental health being out on your own. And the reason I'm asking this Rowan is because there are a lot of parents whose kids are moving out going to college, and they're leaving home with mental health concerns. And moving from a space where it feels like, there's like some containment, you know, that's like making sure they're taking their meds or making sure they're going to therapy, or just, you know, parents are sending them off. And there's this big fear that without the hovering, or even, not always hovering, but just that gentle reminder that young people are going out in the world and just not taking care of their mental health. So I'd love for you to talk a little bit about how you take care of yourself and what you're paying attention to. Okay.

Rowan O'Roarty 16:16
I don't know, I'm definitely depressed. I am diagnosed with depression, and it's there. It's fine. I know it's there. It's not a big deal. I'm medicated, I wake up in the morning, and the first thing I do is take my meds. And I don't know, I just kind of listen to my body. I feel like some days when energy is low, or I'm feeling low, or look at my cat, like, asleep on my bed. I'm like, I should take a day, I should lay in bed. And that helps me like giving myself permission. I don't need to, like feel guilty about taking a day to chill. I'm like, if my cat can chill all the time, every day. I deserve five hours. Like, you know, like whatever I needed to do. I can do it. At another time. Basically, I also found out that my recent depression spell was not depression. Therapy today, we talked about it, and it was PMS. So tracking my cycle, you're gonna start happening and watching my alcohol consumption. Can I say that

Casey O'Roarty 17:37
you can say that it's real. It's real for you. And I know there's other you're 20 you're not of legal age to be drinking. Hello, everyone. I'm aware. We have side conversations about that.

Rowan O'Roarty 17:49
I'm not crazy, everybody. I'm not going crazy out there. I'm just saying that like, I don't need

Casey O'Roarty 17:54
you're watching what you're putting in your body. Yeah, yeah,

Rowan O'Roarty 17:59
definitely. And I've especially recently I've been really conscious about making sure I have fruits and vegetables throughout the day. And I noticed that makes a big difference. And cooking. I fell in love with cooking. I love to cook. I love cooking meals for myself. And it makes me feel good when I actually, it makes me feel tired people because my apartment floors are hard. So my feet hurt. But at the end of like cooking, or like eat my meal. I'm like, No, I just made that. For myself. I'm feeding myself. I'm doing it like depression is there, falling there. But it's like, part of my life. Oh, yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 18:42
Yeah, I think that really speaks to maturity, as well. Because what I'm hearing you say is, you know that you have this thing. Right? And it's kind of this underlying foundational part of you. And you know that there are things you can do that make you feel better, and your act of choosing. Yeah, feel better.

Rowan O'Roarty 19:09
Yeah, I mean, and I'm conscious, it's, I have a chemical imbalance in my brain. It's not like I get moody. It's a chemical imbalance. Like if someone would have like a chronic illness. It's in my brain. And so, like accepting that and just accepting it and just being okay. I can still be happy and I can still do fun things, even when I don't really want to, but I know that it'll make me feel good. Being with friends.

Casey O'Roarty 19:42
Yeah. Here's the other thing too, right? This isn't new for you. And something that came up in this last period of time was you know, you saying, Well, I know that the feel good time is temporary. And me saying and Do you realise that the low times are also temporary? And you said, Yeah, and I think that there's something to the experience of riding that wave. I mean, we all feel that to some degree, right? It's definitely more enhanced when you have something like depression. But it's so interesting. You having had the experience of the last three, four or five years, you have all these times in your back pocket that you can say, oh, yeah, that was a tough time. And then I started to feel better. That was a hard time. And I did X, Y, and Z. And I was able to pull out of it. So I think that that's really inspiring, too. And something for parents to remember that, like, you know, the initial onset of any kind of low or hard time when our kids don't have an experience to say, Oh, I felt like this before. And I know it's gonna be okay. It's really hard, because I remember you being like, there's no cure for depression mom, and like, I Yeah. Really? Yeah. It mean, from my perspective, looking in, it felt like you thought you were just, it's never gonna get better. Yeah.

Rowan O'Roarty 21:13
So there was definitely that, because it was so severe. And it wasn't getting better for a while. And so it was like, where's the end of the tunnel. But also, with that, I feel like you do not have mental health issues, you don't have depression, correct. And I felt like when I was going through depression, it felt to me like you wanted me to be better. Of course, of course you did. First, you want your kids to be happy and love life, of course. And that put weight on me that I didn't want to be better. I wanted to feel how I was feeling. And I wanted it to be okay, that I was feeling that way for a while. And so I think me and you going through DBT, and you're seeing how to support me, because I remember there was a time where you would, you know, take me to the naturopath and naturopath was like It's like she has a broken foot. Like you can't just tell her to go to the gym or like go work out like your body doesn't work like that. I feel like going through DBT with you and you kind of seeing how to support me better, was really important for us. And probably for you also as a parent coach to other parents that maybe also don't experience mental health issues, but their kid is going through it. Because I definitely see like, of course, it's your child, of course, you want them to feel better, or having a hard time like, of course. And as the child going through it. Sometimes it's a lot when your parent is there and wants you to feel better because it feels impossible. And then on top of that, it feels like you're letting your parents down by not being better, and adds up and it keeps bringing you down. And so I feel like recently, for me at least, I've been dealing with depression for like six years. And I've gotten to the point where I have to let myself feel it. Or in my case, it's a lot of not feeling like I become numb. I need to let myself do what I need to do. If it's laying in bed. I'm gonna lay in bed. If it's not leaving the house for the whole day, I'm not gonna go out the house. I don't know, people gotta go to work when I'm depressed. Like, yeah, I'm doing the life things. And when I can. I am allowing myself to feel what's going on in my body. And if that means that I'll go to the gym for a week, I don't go to the gym for a week, just because I know I will feel good at the gym. And I feel comforted. laying in my bed. It's like I'm being hugged by someone that doesn't expect anything.

Casey O'Roarty 24:18
Yeah, that's yeah. And yeah, thank you. Yeah. And it's inspiring. You know, I'm really inspired by how you have gotten to know yourself. And your willingness to be curious about yourself and disassociation is a tool for you. And it's obvious in how you talk that you're not completely disassociated all the time, like your self awareness and this is something

Casey O'Roarty 24:54
when I was giving my talk, everyone I did a talk at the most recent positive discipline conference and I talked about trusting the process and a little bit of your story and dad's story. And, you know, the part that really broke me, in my talk was when I talked about your self awareness. I mean, Rowan, there are adults who are still lacking in self awareness. And I see you and I'm so inspired by your courage, and your willingness, right, because that's the other piece too. Yeah, the bed is comfortable. And at some point, you're tapping into when it feels right for you. You are tapping into a willingness to get up. Oh, yeah. Yeah, tell me about that. Like, how does that show up for you? And you're like, All right, here we go. Or is that how it sounds? That's how it would sound for me.

Rowan O'Roarty 25:56
Yeah, for me. It's when I like, because yes, I dissociate a lot to cope with stuff, especially when I'm particularly depressed. But sometimes I'll snap out of the dissociation. And I will like, I look around my room and I'm like, God, this place is a mess. I get up, like, clean. And then I go into the bathroom. Like this was a mess to clean the back. I do my laundry. Next thing I know, everything is clean. And now I want

Casey O'Roarty 26:29
to shower. So there's some momentum. Next

Rowan O'Roarty 26:31
thing I know, I'm cooking dinner? And I'm fine.

Casey O'Roarty 26:34
Yeah, yeah,

Rowan O'Roarty 26:37
I don't know, it kind of starts from a place of like snapping back into reality, almost because I tend to go into my head. And it's like, I snapped back into reality. And I'm like, nobody else is gonna make me feel better. Like nobody else is gonna clean my room, or clean my apartment or cook me dinner. And I'm capable of doing it for myself. So I'm going to,

Casey O'Roarty 27:01
and I'm hearing there's some momentum in what you were talking about? Oh, my gosh,

Rowan O'Roarty 27:07
definitely. There always is.

Casey O'Roarty 27:09
Okay. Thank you for all of this sharing. Because the thing that people love about when you come on the show, Rohan is you give them a glimpse into the reality of the 20 year old

Rowan O'Roarty 27:23
into the perfect?

Casey O'Roarty 27:26
Well, you know, the kids are not always very forthcoming about their experiences. So it is such a gift that you're willing to come on and be so vulnerable, and willing to share about, like you said, you don't speak for everyone, you're only speaking from your experience. Yes. But even that I am positive that there are listeners who are thinking, Oh, I wonder if this is how my kiddo feels. And I wonder. And then they go into, you know, their relationships and maybe spark some conversations that are really powerful for them. So it's really amazing. And thank you, yay, I love you, listeners. I love I love you to believe. So I recently was texting with Auntie Jenny, Daddy's sister. And she sent me a bunch of pictures from when you guys were kids. And I was telling her about the passing of time and that you and I were making plans for your 21st birthday. And she said, Oh my gosh, that's amazing that she wants to hang out with you for her 21st. And I said, Yeah, you know, we're really good. Like, you know, I've noted to reduce the amount of text that I sent you. So that's noted. No, but I feel like our relationship is so awesome. I'm so grateful. Yeah, what do you appreciate about our evolving relationship and just how I am showing up for you. And the reason I'm asking listeners is one, of course to indulge myself a little bit here row and tell me how great I am. But also, you know, if you can be specific around things that you appreciate as an emerging adult, as a baby adult, as I call you, you know, I'm still your mom, right? I am your mom, I am your parent, and you're willing to talk to me and ask for advice sometimes even are my thoughts which feels really good. So what's helpful? What do you appreciate?

Rowan O'Roarty 29:28
From my perspective? I think it's helped me to move out because yes, before I was 1819 20, whatever. Technically an adult technically making my own decisions, but now I'm like, away, right, like now I can have people over without asking. I can go places without talking to you about it. And so I feel like that allows me to share Were with you. Because I'm like, you can't tell me what to do anymore. Which not that you were and and not like in a bad way, but just in a way that makes me want to share more because it's less like, yes, you're so my mom, but it feels more like I'm becoming more into womanhood. I feel like

Casey O'Roarty 30:20
we're just to do women to be

Rowan O'Roarty 30:23
women. And like, that's the big thing is me going into womanhood and like noticing how I treated you when I was younger, and how the dynamics were and how I don't want that with my daughter. I don't want my daughter to treat me like that. And I feel like, I didn't have that like that way in which, yes, teenage, teenage kid, whatever. But now I feel like I can make it

Casey O'Roarty 30:55
up to you. And you know what, when your daughter moves through adolescence and does her own thing, and is a complete nightmare, I will be here for you. And remind you that it's okay. It will pass your move through it. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I just I love our relationship. And it's so fun. Me too, you know, and I get to continuously check myself like yesterday, I kind of went off the handle for a minute when we were talking about the grey area of morality. And I want to own that.

Rowan O'Roarty 31:26
Yes, people I.

Casey O'Roarty 31:29
Well, I just kind of got a little hot about that. And, you know, I know exactly where that came from. We can talk about it later. And, yeah, I think it's a good reminder of, you know, who our kids are at 1415 1617 is not who they'll always be. And I just am grateful that my response to you was one that allowed for us to be so close now that there wasn't so much hurt. No, yeah, for sure. Because that's something that I talk about. Because I'm

Rowan O'Roarty 32:02
seeing, I don't know if every, like 20 year old thinks this way. Kind of special. But I am seeing things more from your perspective. Where, of course, you've said some of those things. You've said to me, because you're my mother. He worries me, you want me to be the best version of myself. You want me to have the best, like you want me to not be sad. Like you want me to be able to go in public to the grocery store without breaking down. Like, of course, you would try and help me in ways that you thought would help or wait that would help you. That's for me. Yeah. Yeah. And so I'm seeing it like, Of course you did what you did. Of course. It's not like you were disregarding me at all because you didn't. That's logically what would work for you. And I think I'm just seeing things in multiple perspectives now.

Casey O'Roarty 33:02
Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. And Tik Tok

Rowan O'Roarty 33:04
has a big influence. God. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I love Tik Tok. Okay. I will never delete it. Okay, I love Tik Tok. And I get a lot of slideshows on Tik Tok, where are like poems, or they're like, just really deep, deep quotes and statements. And it makes me think, like, deep and I remember a few weeks ago, I sent you that poem about moms,

Casey O'Roarty 33:38
I totally cry.

Rowan O'Roarty 33:39
I read it on the podcast. To my mother. With each year that I grow older, I'm beginning to see how much of yourself you sacrificed and how much you gave to me. So I want you to know, I'm grateful for everything you give. I want you to know, I'm thankful for everything you did. I want you to know I see you or see every beat of your heart. I see your heart that beats for both of us, I see your heart that will never depart. I want you to know I owe it to you. You made me who I am now. I want you to know I love you. I love you more than you know. I want you to know you're incredible. And I'm really proud of you. I know it isn't easy. Everything you do. You always say how lucky you are. I'm sure I'm the lucky one. You may have been blessed with me. I get to call you my mom.

Casey O'Roarty 34:33
And who wrote that?

Rowan O'Roarty 34:35
I don't know. I'm not. I don't take claim.

Casey O'Roarty 34:39
That was very sweet. I think I cried when you sent that to me. So there's hope out there my friends that are struggling. We've got a lot of people in my membership right now who are really struggling with their 15 or 16 year old daughters. And so Rowan, you get to be an example of one possible outcome. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, and now Oh, quick question. Oh god is joyful courage mean to you as a 20 year old? No I should have prepared whatever is top of mind.

Rowan O'Roarty 35:08
Joyful courage. Joyful courage is getting out of bed when you're depressed and take me out the trash because it's the

Casey O'Roarty 35:17
Mic drop. Perfect. I love you so much, Rohan Thank you. I won't text you later. Okay, okay,

Rowan O'Roarty 35:27
I'll ignore you. Well, that's okay.

Casey O'Roarty 35:28
I love you. Bye

Rowan O'Roarty 35:30
Bye Love you bye

Casey O'Roarty 35:39
thank you so much for listening in today. Thank you to my spreadable partners as well as Chris Mann and the team at pod shaper for all the support with getting the show out there and making it sound good. Check out our offers for parents with kids of all ages and sign up for our newsletter to stay connected at beast brothel.com. Tune back in later this week for our Thursday show and I'll be back with another interview next Monday. Peace

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