Eps 565: Parenting Teens with the End in Mind

Joyful courage is about showing up… I know I say this over and over again, but that is what it is. It’s showing up when it’s hard to do; it’s showing up when it is inconvenient, when you don’t want to… It is finding ease in showing up and being open-hearted to the people you love (and compassionate with yourself).

Transcription

JC Ep 565 (4.17.25) - Final
[00:00:00] Casey O'Roarty: Welcome, welcome, welcome to the Joyful Courage Podcast. This is a place where parents of tweens and teens come to find inspiration, information, and encouragement. In the messy terrain of adolescents, this season of parenting is no joke. And while the details of what we're all moving through might be slightly different, we are indeed having a very collective experience.
[00:00:30] This is a space where we center building, relationship, nurturing life skills, and leaning into our own personal growth and man. The opportunities abound, right. My name is Casey O'Roarty. I am a parent coach, positive discipline lead trainer, and captain of the adolescent ship over at Sproutable. I'm also a speaker and a published author.
[00:00:53] I've been working with parents and families for over 20 years. And continue to navigate my own experience of being a mom with my two young adult kids. I'm so honored that you're here and listening. Please give back to the podcast by sharing it with friends or on social media rate and review us on Apple or Spotify.
[00:01:13] Word of mouth is how we grow. Thank you so, so much. Enjoy the show.
[00:01:24] Hey everybody. Hi. Welcome back to the show. So excited to be recording for you right now. I'm coming off of a really special weekend of fun and frolicking with friends and with Ben, my husband, who is. Recovering from shoulder surgery and yeah, I'm in a really good place of ease and acceptance and connection with him, and that feels really great.
[00:01:54] That feels really great. 'cause you know, midlife long-term relationships, they are real. And an ebb and a flow, and I think if you've been listening regularly for the last couple years, you probably can hear my ebb and flow and. I've been posting on my Facebook, my personal Facebook, just about Ben's journey, his health journey, and how we're doing, and I get a lot of people who comment, you know, I'm, I'm pretty candid with how I write.
[00:02:25] If you're on my newsletter list, you know this. I just kind of tell the story of current events, right? I am really just candid about what's going on, and. It's interesting. I often will get feedback from people saying things like, you are a great example for all of us. And. And while that, that feels awesome, like I'm happy to be an example, I'm happy to be someone that inspires or prompts others because I'm super into personal growth.
[00:03:00] Like I just think that every event and experience, every challenge in life is this grand opportunity to get to know yourself better. And. Be curious about why you respond the way you respond, and I think we're just all here to relate to each other better. That's what I'm here for. And so if I can share my experience in a way that.
[00:03:30] Is helpful for others. Yay. I'm happy about that. I'm happy about that. So Monday was our first show of the Positive Discipline for Teens book review. Did you listen? I covered the first three chapters of the Positive Discipline for Teenagers book. I love that book. I love revisiting it and remembering like, oh yeah, this is gold.
[00:03:55] There's just great stuff in there, and I feel like every time I read it. It's deeper, it makes more sense, you know? And now I've got kids that are no longer in the house and I'm reading it again, and it's just like, yes, yes, yes, yes. So I hope that you're reading along with me. I will be back on Monday to do the second part of that book review, covering chapters four, five, and six.
[00:04:21] So we're gonna just kind of take a slow pace. We're gonna read three chapters at a time. So. The whole review will be over the course of about five weeks, so you can jump in, come jump in and be a part of the discussion. I'd love it if you were, one of the things that gets talked about in that first section of the book is I.
[00:04:41] Long-term parenting, you know, and when we talk about positive discipline and really just this whole podcast I think is geared towards long-term parenting. What do we want in the long-term? Right? I think it's so easy. I. Because we're busy and it feels like there's a million fires to tend to. It's really easy to be in kind of the short term, day-to-day situation.
[00:05:09] Right. And we kind of take our eyes off the prize of. The big picture, right? And remembering like the big picture of things. This is a small amount of time. I mean, we've got the first 11, 12 years and they're little kids, and then we've got, you know, another 10 to 12 years. They might be in the house for most of that, but they're transitioning into young adulthood.
[00:05:32] And then they've got the rest of their life, as do we. So, you know, this is a small period of time and yes, you've heard me say this, yes, it's a small period of time and yes, it matters. How we show up matters. What happens during this period of time matters, but it is not quite. As intense as we can make it out to be.
[00:05:58] So think about what are your long-term parenting goals? When you think and project out into the future, what do you want most? Like beyond whatever shenanigans you're navigating right now with your teenager, beyond what is real and alive in this current snapshot that you're living in. Not dismissing that, acknowledging it, but beyond that, what do you want most?
[00:06:22] When you look into the future for your kiddos, most people when I ask this question, you know, most clients and parents that I talk to, they talk about a mentally, physically, emotionally, healthy, young person who self-sufficient, right, and a decent human. Don't we want that? Yes, please. And you know, when I think about it, when I think about my kids.
[00:06:50] I want them to feel content. I want them to feel content and yes, healthy. And I want them to understand and believe that they're the designers of their life, right? They get to decide how it feels to move through their experience. That's what I want for them. And. When I think about my adult kids, I wanna have a solid relationship with them.
[00:07:17] Like I wanna be in communication with them. I want to talk to them regularly. I want them to call and ask my advice, or call me and share things, or just check in. Right. Ultimately, that's the most exciting thing to me when I think about the future. Like I want a really good relationship with my adult kids.
[00:07:38] And when I think about that, like what if we knew without a doubt that we were gonna get there? What if we knew right? Like everybody's gonna be okay. They're gonna be in their mid to late twenties living their life the way they wanna live it, connecting with us. How would we show up differently right now if we knew without a doubt that they were growing through what they're going through?
[00:08:10] So for me, that's the reality that I wanna live in. I just want to believe that my kiddo is growing through what they're going through, even. If there's no evidence, right? Even if the indicators are yikes, we're kind of in a shit storm right now, right? Even if that's the case, which it might be the case for you, right?
[00:08:34] And what if everybody's gonna be okay? What if the learning that's happening inside of the shit storm is exactly the learning that your kiddo needs right now to evolve and grow into that? Young adult human being who is content and understands deeply that they're the designers of their life, right? I wanna live in that reality.
[00:09:01] I wanna live in a space where I have faith and hope and just enough detachment that I can keep remembering and asking myself, what does my kiddo need most from me right now when I get that text or that share, or I'm in that conversation? What does my kid need most from me right now? And I know that it's easier said than done, right?
[00:09:24] But here's what we're gonna do today. So I employed chat GPT to help me with content because I was thinking about this long-term parenting, and I went to chat GPT and I asked. Top things parents of teens do that makes things worse. I thought that'd be a pretty funny request, and I thought, yeah, we'll see what chat GPT comes up with.
[00:09:50] And guess what? Of course, my best friend chat, GPT, came up with 10 things that parents do. Get in the way and make things worse. And guess what we're gonna do now is review them. We're gonna review them, okay? So I'm gonna talk about each thing, and I'm gonna invite you to do things a little bit differently.
[00:10:17] So the first thing that parents do that makes things worse is trying to control everything. We micromanage our kids' schedules or their friendships or their decisions, and we just push them away. We push them towards rebellion or shutting down, and maybe this is like early days, right? Early teen years, and then later on they're like, get outta my life.
[00:10:44] Or maybe we are still doing that. And our kids are 16, 17, 18, trying to control everything. Is not useful. Autonomy is major at this age, right? Our kids are learning to make decisions and they have to have room to make decisions. I actually did a talk, a live talk last week at Lincoln High School in Seattle.
[00:11:09] Great turnout of parents, and yeah, that was one of the points that I make, is we want our kids to be good decision makers. But the only way they learn to be good decision makers if is if they have room to make decisions. So what do we do? Instead of micromanaging? Let it go. Let your team take the lead, right?
[00:11:28] Ask questions if that's gonna calm you down and help you remember that your team has some decent consideration skills, or maybe they don't, but your neutral curiosity will help them think deeper. About the choices they are making, the questions you are asking, right? We're not asking questions for the answer that we wanna hear, but instead we're planting some seeds and we're prompting critical thinking, right?
[00:11:57] So letting go of the idea that you control your kids' life, that you can control their path because you can't. And if you wanna stay connected, and if you want that eye on the prize of a long-term relationship with your kiddo, letting go of the micromanaging now will serve. Okay. Neutral curiosity. Giving them space.
[00:12:20] Staying connected, absolutely. But letting them take the lead. Letting them really live inside of the autonomy that they want. And guess what? This might be really major for you. You might need to get some extra support like coaching or therapy, or even if you're not already inside of a community that is focused on parenting teenagers, it's so useful to remember.
[00:12:44] You aren't the only one who has a hard time letting go and has the fear of worst case scenario, really top of mind. So be in community with other people and talk about these things. Help yourself be with. What's coming up for you inside of community or with support? Right, so number one was we get in the way by trying to control everything.
[00:13:06] The second thing that we do that makes things worse is we shut down emotions, right? When our kiddos are sharing something and they're in a heightened state of emotion, we might say things like, oh, you're overreacting. It's not that big of a deal. Keeping in mind, teen brain development teens feel everything really intensely, the highs and the lows.
[00:13:30] And when we dismiss their emotions, it makes them feel unseen or ashamed for feeling anything at all. Right? So instead, what we can do, we can validate their experience, we can mirror listen, we can let them know I hear you, and that sounds really tough. Right. And I think that the reason we shut down emotions is because of how uncomfortable we feel with our teens emotional experience.
[00:14:00] And we wanna fix things. We want them to feel better. We wanna find the silver lining and sh and shift that, that experience that they're having. 'cause it's so hard for us to see them in that tough experience. But what your teen wants most. Is to feel seen in what they're going through. They don't wanna hear you say, oh, this isn't a big deal.
[00:14:24] They wanna know you're on their side. Just be with them. Problem solving is available and will continue to be available, and you'll get there in time once your kiddo is ready. And guess what? It may be that they don't even need problem solving, right? They just need to know that you're there. They just need a place to dump.
[00:14:46] What they're feeling in the moment, which could change very quickly. So put your own stuff aside and listen, right? Listen and allow them to be in their emotions.
[00:15:07] The third thing on the list. Being overly suspicious. Oh my gosh. Does anybody slide into this? I've been known to definitely be overly suspicious. It looks like snooping through their phones. It looks like interrogating them about every detail, especially without reason searching their room. Right. This breaks trust.
[00:15:36] Fast and this like really influences the collective space that you're holding with and for them. And it stops being a place where they feel safe. Stops being a place where they feel like they can come and bring you the big stuff and gets support. That's not what you want. You want them to come to you.
[00:15:57] You wanna be a trusted, wise guide, an elder, a person who. Your kiddos turn to because they need help. Right. When we're overly suspicious, all we're doing is teaching our kids to hide things, not to be more honest, this really isn't useful in any relationship. Right. It makes it hard to connect. I know that.
[00:16:23] It's true. There's a lot that our teens can get into. A hundred percent. I know, and it's scary. And we wanna know what they're up to and we wanna shut down the scary stuff. But you know what, maybe we don't need to know everything. Uh, maybe we don't need to know everything. I mean, yeah, if there's something dangerous happening, patterns that seem to be getting in the way of them living their life, of course, yes.
[00:16:53] Ask about it. Snoop around if you need to, but these are extreme cases. And I think you get to start with, Hey babe, I'm noticing some things. I've got some questions for you. Help me understand what's going on. 'cause here's what I'm seeing, right? When suspicion shows up, pause for a second and ask yourself, where is this coming from?
[00:17:17] Is this a real or valid concern? Can I trust my kiddo to navigate it? And can you be emotionally honest with your teen about how you're feeling, right? Like I already said, Hey, here's what I'm noticing. Here's what I'm feeling. I need to talk to you about it. Right? If you've already been overly suspicious, I know that you are out there, you parents that have already kind of leaned into.
[00:17:45] This overly suspicious energy, and if it's tainted, the dynamic. If you're in that place of struggle where your kid really shuts you out, doesn't share, doesn't trust you, go clean it up, right? Let them know you're doing the best you can, and yes, your nerves and your anxiety get the better of you, and you get scared.
[00:18:08] You get Snoopy. Right. And from now on, you're gonna get the support you need to manage your anxiety and give them space, but also come to them with curiosity instead of sneaking around. Right? This is really important. I mean, you know, when I think about. I think about what my kids have been through. I think about what my teen years looked like, and I was very sneaky.
[00:18:38] I didn't believe that my parents could handle what I was doing and what I wanted to share with them. So I didn't. And I got into some trouble and it could have gotten really bad, but it didn't view, and for most of our kids it won't. But yeah. I wonder often what life would've been like. Had I been able to have a, a really open, honest relationship with my parents when I was moving through some really interesting identity, who am I development stuff?
[00:19:11] Yeah, for sure. Okay. Fourth way we get in the way of those long-term goals, we lecture. We lecture instead of listen. And when a teen opens up and a parent launches into a TED talk. Yeah, the door's gonna slam real quick. Right. Teens crave being heard more than being taught, especially when they're venting.
[00:19:39] Okay. I'm gonna say that again. Teens crave being heard more than being taught. I know. It's disappointing 'cause you've got so much to teach them. I know. Me too. And let's not start there. Let's listen. Let's listen to know and understand our kid and to know what it is that they need and to know what they're asking for, right?
[00:20:07] They're rarely asking for a lecture, so stop giving those lectures. Stop giving those TED talks as as exciting, and I'm sure informative as they are. Lean into listening, right? I've definitely given more than one Ted Talk to my family, and I promise you. When you stop talking and you do more listening, you know what happens.
[00:20:30] You get to know the team that you have. You get to hear all the ways their critical thinking is developing, and you get a glimpse into their world, which is such a gift. It's such a gift. So more listening, less talking. Catch yourself and it's okay. Like if you've launched into a lecture and you realize like you watch their eyes glaze over and you realize you've gone there, you get to say, oh man, okay, I'm gonna pause right now 'cause I realize I'm in lecture mode and I don't know that you didn't ask for that.
[00:21:06] So I'm just gonna pause and instead ask you tell me more about what you're going through or what else do you want me to know or how can I be supportive? Right. Any of those things are gonna be better than a lecture. Number five. One of the ways that some parents get in the way of those long-term goals is by acting emotionless or being too tough, right?
[00:21:38] Trying to be the rock or the authority. 24 7 can make parents seem unapproachable. Vulnerability when appropriate, actually builds connection. And I think this is like I, you know. I don't know. What is it about the parent child relationship where it makes me crazy when people are like, I am, I'm not here to be your their friend.
[00:22:03] I'm here to be their parent. I think I mentioned this in a recent show, like, why not both? Why can't we be both Because we are in an emotional relationship with our children. We are human beings relating to having a relationship with other human beings. Now granted, these other human beings are our offspring, and for the first go, the first little bit of time while they're under our roof, yes, they have limited skills.
[00:22:32] They are growing in developing over time, but that doesn't make them less human than we are, right? And when we hold this like hierarchy in the household, like, oh, I'm the parent, I'm the authority. So you gotta do what I tell you, right? I mean that we can pull that off for a while when they're younger, but once they become teenagers, they're kind of like, uh, no, you're not the boss of me.
[00:22:58] I can do what I want. And they can. And you can use all the leverage, you can use all the carrots and sticks, and at the end of the day, our kids are gonna do what they wanna do. And so when I think about that. You know, it's a wild ride for them to move through adolescence. I want them to know that I'm here for it, I can hold it.
[00:23:23] And also, yes, I'm gonna validate the human experience is a wild ride. Whether you're in your teenage years or in your fifties, or anywhere in between, before, after, like, yes, it's wild and. I think we do our kids a disservice when we aren't our authentic human selves with them. They get to see healthy human experiences, emotions, decision making, poor decision making, making it right.
[00:23:57] The only way they learn how to be with all of this, how to be humans in the world is through experiencing us and the other humans that they see, but primarily us. They spend a lot of time with us. So, yeah, don't be emotionless. Be real, right? Don't act like you'd need to be so tough. You know, typically I notice, not always, but a lot of times some of the dads that I work with tend to lean into this tough.
[00:24:28] Toughen 'em up stance and it's just not useful. It's not gonna get you to those long-term goals. It's just not so soften up. Be human. Connect with your kiddos on a human level, right? Number six, invalidating or minimizing their world. You've heard me talk about this. You know when we say things like, it's not that big of a deal, it's just high school drama.
[00:24:54] You'll understand when you're older. That's bullshit. Quit it. Don't say those things to your teenager. It is so rude. Their world right now is high school. It is middle school. It's their friends. It's their first love. It is like it or not, what's going on on social media. It is real to them. It's real to them.
[00:25:21] This moment right now is everything for your kiddos, right? What they will hopefully experience over time is that things only get better, right? I mean, that's the goal that I have is. If I'm doing life right, then life is only getting better even inside of the things that are challenging. Every era is temporary.
[00:25:42] We move through the ebb and flow, but right now what's going on with them right now, it's huge and it matters to them and it's important that we respect that with the energy that we bring. Right? Going back to like not being able to sit with their emotions or. You know, we talk about how teenagers eye roll us.
[00:26:03] Oh my God, we are like walking eye rolls so much of the time. So check yourself and connect with them and hear them and hold what they're going through as sacred for them.
[00:26:24] Okay, that one got me fired up. Uh, number seven. Ways that we get in the way expecting adult level logic. This is so funny and I totally relate to this. Teen brains are still developing, especially the part responsible for planning judgment, self-regulation. Okay? When we expect consistent, rational behavior, we are setting ourselves up for disappointment and arguing.
[00:26:51] I mean, think about how often you screw up. Think about how often your organization is poor. Your judgment is not good in the moment or when your self-regulation leaves the room and you freak out and fall apart, right? You're a fully baked adult. These are your teenagers. They're still developing the parts of the brain that prefrontal cortex.
[00:27:17] They're living a large part of their time in their limbic system, which is that reactive, responsive, survival instinct part of the brain. So, okay, don't take it personally. Give them a little bit of space and just remember like they're acting this way because their brain is under development, right? And they're doing the best they can with the tools they have in the moment in response to you.
[00:27:45] So. You're a part of it as well. Number eight. Number eight ways that we get in the way, focusing only on outcomes. Always asking about grades, achievements, or chores without checking in emotionally, they start to feel like they're only as good as their performance in your eyes. So it's interesting. As I was creating this podcast for you all, I was Snapchatting with my son who's in college.
[00:28:15] And I Snapchat with him 'cause he told me that that is a surefire way for me to get a response. So I Snapchat with my son and we were talking, you know, he has recently shared with me that he's not doing so great in his math class. And we kind of went back and forth about that and what he could be doing differently to get different results.
[00:28:36] And so we were texting today and I asked him about math. Then I was thinking about this and then I texted him like, how are you doing emotionally? Are you feeling stressed, overwhelmed, content capable? All of it. None of it, you know, I just highlighted he's about to, he's rounding out. He's in the last few weeks of his first year of college, and my guess is there's a lot of emotion that is.
[00:29:07] Right there under the surface that he may or may not be paying attention to. And so I just wanted him to know, like, I see you. I see you in all of that, and how's it going? Right. Checking in on his emotional wellbeing reminds him that his emotional wellbeing matters. Right? A lot actually to me. So yeah, checking in on them beyond the outcomes, even though I know.
[00:29:36] You know, especially those of you who are in like college application season or you're kind of thinking about that and we get so worked up about wanting to make sure all the doors are open and everything feels so heavy and deadlines that get missed. I mean, it is, it can feel really crazy. Or even having a kiddo that's maybe a freshman or a sophomore and.
[00:29:59] You know, you are thinking ahead to college and what doors are gonna be open, and maybe your kiddo will go to college, maybe they'll do something different. But keep in mind that there's a lot more to your kid than their performance, their outcomes. And meet them there. Meet them out beyond their grades and their achievements.
[00:30:23] See the human and get to know the human that they are. Number nine, what do we do that gets in the way we punish instead of guiding? This one's funny to me. Consequences are important, but constant punishment without discussion leads to fear not growth. I don't think you all listening. Or about the constant punishment.
[00:30:47] I don't think that's happening at your house. I don't think this is the podcast for you, if that's your style. I do know that people love to talk about consequences. And let me just tell you right here, right now, I'm gonna say it again 'cause I have the opportunity. Logical consequences. Yes, you put those into place.
[00:31:06] Logical consequences are related to the behavior. Respectful, reasonable. If possible revealed in advance, right? Natural consequences happen when you stay out of the way. I love natural consequences, right? I love natural consequences. So keep in mind when we're talking about discipline here, it's about teaching.
[00:31:30] It's about guiding. It's not about controlling, it's about influencing and being connected. Like when I think about am I disciplined in, like for me, discipline is routine. It's systems, it's structure, right? It's keeping myself on the path that I've declared I wanna be on, and what do I need to put into place?
[00:31:50] What's the scaffolding that helps me get there? So, shifting the conversation with your teenager to focus on what do you want? What's the scaffold, the systems, the routines that are gonna help you get there. How can I be of service? So we get to guide, we get to hold structure, and we get to give them lots of freedom within the structure because we want them to have natural consequences.
[00:32:14] We want them to fall down and get up and fall down and get up and wonder, how can I do this differently to get different results? We want that. We want that experience for them. That is where they grow and develop and learn. Yeah,
[00:32:31] so. Finally number 10. Oh, sweet number 10, sweet number 10, the 10 ways, the 10th way that we get in the way of long-term results, which is again, content capable kiddos who are adults and having a relationship with them. Number 10, making everything about you. Right. This is one of the ways that we get in the way and some of the things we say are, ah, I never would've talked to my parents that way.
[00:33:05] Or You're, so, this is embarrassing to me. Right? When we center ourselves, teens feel like their struggles are secondary or invisible, or they're already carrying around the weight of whatever it is they're going through. And now on top of it is disappointing you. Right or hurting you or whatever emotional experience it is that you are having.
[00:33:33] So I do believe that we get to be emotionally honest with our kiddos. I believe that we get to be real and authentic, but we also get to remember that we are not the center of our teens world. We're copilots, we're passengers. Right? Hopefully we have a seat at the table. But we are not the center, so quit diving in there.
[00:34:02] Right? Again, all of these I think, are so counteracted by curiosity. Like just be curious about what your kid's going through, you know, instead of staying at the surface, staying at the tip of the iceberg where the behavior lives, and you're just focused on chipping away at that. Get deep Wow. I noticed that I'm having an experience based on this behavior, but what's the most important to me is the experience you're having.
[00:34:32] So tell me about that. Tell me about what's going on with you. Right? You wanna make it about, you get a journal, write it all down in your journal, right? All the ways that your teenager is making your life more miserable or harder or whatever. Right. Get it out. Get it on paper, but don't bring it to them.
[00:34:55] Right? Don't bring it to them. Instead, center them. Be curious about them. Right. Do what you need to do. To hold space so that, again, like I've said a few times now today, so that they feel seen and heard.
[00:35:18] There you go. 10 ways that parents get in the way of those long-term parenting goals and hopefully plenty of nuggets for you to take away so that you're. Not getting in the way, right, so that we all have kiddos that are developing into content capable, contributing members of society, because isn't that what we need right now?
[00:35:46] Human beings that are content, that are capable, and that are making contributions to the world for all. That's what I want. That's my dream. That's my vision. I'd love to hear from you. What do you think? What did you notice about these 10 things that get in the way? 10 things that we do. Which ones spoke loudest to you?
[00:36:12] And of course if you heard anything and you're like, man, I could really use some support on this. You know where to find me. Book a 15 minute free call. Let's see if we're the right fit for each other to do some one-on-one work, or if maybe there's another offer or even some podcast episodes that I can suggest to help you with whatever you're moving through.
[00:36:32] But you can go to besproutable.com/explore, and that will take you right to a page where you can get on my schedule. All right. Thank you for being here. Thank you for listening, and I will see you next time. Have a great day. Take care of yourself. Drink water. Do all the things. Okay. Bye.
[00:37:01] Thank you so much for listening. Thank you to my Sprout Partners, Julietta and Alana. Thank you, Danielle, for supporting with the show notes as well as Chris Mann and the team at PodShaper for all the support with getting the show out there and making it sound good. As I mentioned, sharing is caring. If you're willing to pass on this episode to others or take a few minutes to rate and review the show on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, it helps other parents find this.
[00:37:27] Useful content. Be sure to check out what we have going on for parents of kids of all ages and sign up for our newsletter to stay connected besproutable.com. I see you doing all the things. I believe in you. See you next time.